Spark plug adapter size

[Yowakawaka]

Hi Everyone,

Don’t come in here often since I use my 2011 fiesta for a daily driver and it’s proven to be pretty reliable. It’s had some problems recently but I’m going to make a different thread for that.

For this thread, I want to make this thing pass smog with a bad cat. I k ow it’s bad because the check engine code is p0420. I was told I can put a spark plug adapter on the downstream o2 sensor and it’ll pass. Does anyone k ow what size to use? A link would be helpful as well.

Thank you in advance.

The next thread I post will be more fun and work related (;

 

[scotman]

I don't believe that trick you described is workable. Sounds like a combination of urban legend and wishful thinking. Prior to the the low catalyst efficiency mil, did you have any misfire mil or O2 sensor mil?
It's very important to know and correct issues that have damaged the catalyst or oxygen sensors before you open up the wallet.

 

[Mercurios2011]

Hi Everyone,

Don’t come in here often since I use my 2011 fiesta for a daily driver and it’s proven to be pretty reliable. It’s had some problems recently but I’m going to make a different thread for that.

For this thread, I want to make this thing pass smog with a bad cat. I k ow it’s bad because the check engine code is p0420. I was told I can put a spark plug adapter on the downstream o2 sensor and it’ll pass. Does anyone k ow what size to use? A link would be helpful as well.

Thank you in advance.

The next thread I post will be more fun and work related (;

Is a park plug fouler 18mm( dorman #42009)

While it "may" pass , you could be walking into a serious problem if that Catalytic converter is clogged ,

you can buy a bottle that is called CataClean and it does work as long as you follow directions on the bottle , I myself used it before

however is temporary but maybe enough to allow you to pass , don't sleep on that code as it can cause major problems down the road

like Scott mentioned O2 sensors is a good starting point specially if the vehicle has over 150K,

I hope this helps

 

[Handy Andy]

I think with all the money you're going to put into that car for that emissions test - just to pass it...

...Would it be better to just replace that catalyst?

You can't fix a broken - plugged - crushed - honeycomb in the converter - there's no way to - unless it's taken apart to inspect. Even then you'd have to buy a new one - at least it's safer to do so because you really don't lose anything in the process - if anything you've got some assurance and a more fuel efficiency result from it.

It won't make the car more valuable for resale - but it will pass the test

 

[Yowakawaka]

Thanks for the replies.

The engine code has been on since I’ve had the car. It’s been about 2 years and about 25k miles. Maybe more/longer.

I replaced the o2 sensor with a factory one and it didn’t get rid of the light. I don’t think the cat would cause any problems other than the code because I don’t think it’s clogged. The reason is because my gas mileage is great 32+. I calculate every tank. I think it’s just broken. Plus, there’s no oil on the plugs so I’m pretty sure it didn’t get clogged with oil. Not sure what else would cause the code.

What other problems can the check engine code cause?

I like working in cars but the only ones I’ve worked on are an 83 S10 and 85 S15 Jimmy. Both motor pulls but they are identical. One is just 4x4. So, when it comes to cars, I have some knowledge. I will say, newer cars are a lot harder to work on. Carburetors and distributors are much easier to work on.

 

[Mercurios2011]

Thanks for the replies.

The engine code has been on since I’ve had the car. It’s been about 2 years and about 25k miles. Maybe more/longer.

I replaced the o2 sensor with a factory one and it didn’t get rid of the light. I don’t think the cat would cause any problems other than the code because I don’t think it’s clogged. The reason is because my gas mileage is great 32+. I calculate every tank. I think it’s just broken. Plus, there’s no oil on the plugs so I’m pretty sure it didn’t get clogged with oil. Not sure what else would cause the code.

What other problems can the check engine code cause?

I like working in cars but the only ones I’ve worked on are an 83 S10 and 85 S15 Jimmy. Both motor pulls but they are identical. One is just 4x4. So, when it comes to cars, I have some knowledge. I will say, newer cars are a lot harder to work on. Carburetors and distributors are much easier to work on.

On a bone stock Fiesta, you should get between 38 and up to 44 mpg on highway (last trip from Florida to West Virginia)*

I get 37 on average , and my cars exhaust is completely aftermarket with no Catalitic Converter + race headers .

What kills me is the fact that I have to go thru town on my way to work and it can not be avoided plus sometimes I'm spirit driving, when my cat was starting to go bad, the car on average was getting 32 to 34 mpg on the exact same trip to work even at cruising speeds,and this was after replacing boths o2 sensors and cam sensors ,now my ecm is flashed to compensate for the lack of the converter and the catback system, otherwise it would run too rich and get horrible gas mileage as well .

 

[Yowakawaka]

@Mercurios2011 I took a trip from around Disneyland to the Sequoias and got around 39 mpg if I remember right. Couldn’t believe it. I normally get 32-35 depending on the amount of city driving I do or where I go.

 

[SyntheticAtmosphere]

Here is your list of possible causes for a P0420...

• Exhaust manifold damage or leakage
• Exhaust pipe damage or leakage
• Misfiring engine
• Catalytic converter oil contamination
• Irregular engine coolant temperature sensor
• A faulty rear or front oxygen sensor
• Oxygen sensor wiring damage
• Loose connection in the O² wiring
• Fuel injector leakage
• High fuel pressure
• Filling your vehicle with the wrong fuel type (i.e., leaded instead of unleaded fuel)
• Faulty Charcoal canister purge valve/vent valve
• Overfilling fuel tank causing Charcoal canister saturation
• Converter corrosion

All of these issues cause the catalytic converter to operate outside of its designed parameters. Finding the culprit is key.
I have never seen a catalytic converter fail without being acted upon by outside factor.
Even a small problem that has festered for a long time usually causes the substrate in the converter to degrade and reduces its ability to efficiently convert emissions to an acceptable level. This will cause the PCM to display the CEL.

 

[Yowakawaka]

I was going to save this for another post but the car has what I think is a misfire. It shuts off sometimes when I’m at a stop. The rpm will go up and down sometimes too but it’s rare. It does fine in the highway and cruse speeds. It’s just at stops it acts up. The temp light comes on when it sits running sometimes too.

Il start with checking the exhaust manifolds leak. What’s the best way to test this?

Sorry for all the questions. I’m not very savvy with these new vehicles. I am very willing to learn tho.

Thank you!

 

[SyntheticAtmosphere]

I would keep it all one post till we get to the conclusion.
Looking for manifold leaks usually manifest as audible when under load or when cold. Also look for black soot lines. Concentrate on gaskets, bolt bosses and where runners split (Y)
Now, from your previous post...
You feel you have a misfire? Do you have a flashing check engine light? How have you deducted a misfire?
~Im going to suggest you look for a vacuum leak, misfire at idle, stalling, hunting RPM, fine at speed.
Your temp light comes on while idling? Coolant level is OK? How many miles on the car? Can you verify the age or condition of the waterpump?
~With the misfire and Cat issue, have you considered a possible head gasket leak or metallurgical phisher/crack?

 

[Handy Andy]

IF you can see if your 2011 Fiesta has a HEC - if it does then you can "monitor" several events and scroll thru some live data as you drive.

You just press and hold that button down on your Pods - as you start it - as you hold it, "test" will show up - then you've got it in the menu and you can just press that button and scroll thru over 20+ "functions" with many of them live data to help you determine the problems or if you need to see what the PCM is working with.



This display is about as close as you can get without having to go with a hand scanner tool - although the tool itself - if it's capable of it - can do a lot more than just "look"

​

 

[Yowakawaka]

@SyntheticAtmosphere I’ll be sure to check the intake manifold leak. I’ve looked at where the manifold connects to the engine but never the actual manifold itself.

I don’t have a flashing check engine light. I just learned that was a thing now. Thanks!

I believe it’s missing because it stumbles and shuts off when at idle.

Also, the RPM go up and down sometimes too. For example, it idles around 800 RPM normally. Sometimes it’ll jump just above1000 RPM and drop back down to 800. Then just repeats. I’ll usually give it gas, about 2000 RPM, and it’ll stop. I did this twice and I figured it’s bad so I don’t do it anymore but I would blip the throttle to make the RPMs jump a bit. Sure enough, it would make the RPMs jump on repeat. Just a confirmation that something was wrong.

I’ve looked around the intake manifold and sprayed carb cleaner around before and didn’t get any idle change. No leaking oil anywhere or anything. It does eat about a court between oil changes tho but I think that’s fairly normal. How would you go about looking for a vacuum leak on this car?

I’m not sure if all of this is related to one or multiple problems.

As for the overheating. The overheating light comes on when sitting in traffic for too long. I’ll just pull to the side of the road and wait for a bit then keep going when it cools. But it only does this when sitting or going very slow, not cursing or highway. About a year ago, I drove it to Vegas and the radiator spring a small leak about a week after I got back. With the help for some of you on this forum, I was able to fix it. There’s coolant and it’s all there still so no leaks. Maybe a sticking thermostat?

Don’t think there’s a bad head gasket because there’s now milkshakes in the oil or radiator. Would it show with the pink coolant? I know that’s the case with the green.

I can’t verify the condition of the water pump but it looks shiny. Everything under the hood looks great. The previous owner took very good care of the car.

It has 140k miles. I’ve had it for about 2 years and this is the first big problem it’s given me.

@Handy Andy I didn’t know the car could do that ether. I’ll give it a look!

I’ll be looking at this stuff over the weekend sometime and will let you guys know how it goes.

Really appreciate the help!!!

 

[Yowakawaka]

@SyntheticAtmosphere I think it could be the water pump. I was listening and the noise I thought was a misfire sounds like it’s coming from the front of the motor. Is there an easy way to tell if it’s the water pump? Also, would my problems (like the shutting off) be caused by a bad one?

I got the spark plug adapter in and am going to try to smog it tomorrow. I’ll let you know how it goes.

 

[SyntheticAtmosphere]

Modern engines shouldn't use a bit of oil although they can seem to run fine when they do. Oil consumption is usually a sign of an issue and quantity is a measure of severity. I dont think however you are in line for an engine failure, possibly just something to live with. That slow oil usage could be related to the P0420 as the converter is having to possibly deal with burnt oil soot or rich exhaust if the oil is present in the combustion chamber or seeping past the exhaust guides. In your 2nd post you mentioned looking at the plugs and they were not bathed in oil. Were they lightly coated in white/light tan dusting? Perhaps if you have access to a compression tester and leak-down tester you will be able to find out where the oil is going and also verify the general health of your engine.

Also, if you are not loosing any coolant, I would assume the system is sealed and the head gasket is not compromised. I asked based on the misfire and over heating. I would check into the water pump...
Look for weeping or wetness, usually from the shaft output of the pump and running under the pump..
With the engine running, carefully hold a screwdriver between the pump housing and your ear to listen to the bearings.
Remove the accessory belt and check for any play in the pump shaft. Also spin the pulley.
Run the engine with the accessory belt removed for a short time to see if any of your issues are still present or reduced.
Note, The accessory belt is a 1 time use stretch belt. You will need a new one on hand and possibly an installation tool.
Short of these checks, disassembly is the next move. Replacing the Tstat is also a good idea, at 140k, its time if it hasnt already been replaced. Also not being a costly adventure its a great place to start.

As a side note, I also notice that these cars warm up very quickly in cool weather. This leads me to believe that the cooling system in these cars isnt large or overly efficient. @scotman has eluded to some of the shortfalls in the Fiestas cooling abilities found through daily use and spirited driving/auto-x. Be cognisant of repeated overheating issues related to the fragility of this platform.

Is there a correlation between the overheating and idle issues?
Edit: Have you cleaned the MAF sensor recently? Also scrutinize the MAF connector.

 

[Handy Andy]

When you have oil consumption - check the spark plugs for soot and or oil on the tip.

​

Found this on the net...might be worth a look-see here...

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There may be issues around those plugs. the above graphic represents a "Heat Range" chart and also shows the Oil fouling on the tip that I see from many owners that overfill their crankcase (Upper Left photos)

• - oftentimes get to look like that because the oil gets pulled back into the combustion chamber from usually - two sources - the rings pumping the oil out of the crankcase thru splashing - and through the PCV valve, on; say a Fiesta, thru a "side port" off the block just under the cylinder head.
• Oil from blow-by usually gets sucked back in thru the PCV valve and leaves an ash or white powdery crud from excessive gasses from the power stroke - that blows by the rings and poofs out into the crankcase. This stuff is the crud that has oil gas air mixed together and may even still be burning only to be quenched by the oil and lack of oxygen in the crankcase
  • These are fumes and can be re-burned even at the catalytic converter - gets caught up in the PCV purge vacuum or out the upper foul air pipe to the filter and snorkel, only to get pulled in the intake as part of the filtration process - this can also plug up your air filter itself from the oily soot if it's really bad.
• - oil wet stuff means the oil level may be too high and the PCV sucks that oil in directly and fouls out those plugs from RAW oil (not diluted or fouled out oil "smoke")

​

• So really, you have to look at the plugs to find out the "why" the mis-fire condition.
• As @SyntheticAtmosphere eluded to, you may also have a plugged MAF/IMAPT sensor
  • - since yours is a 2011 - Intake Manifold Air Pressure Temperature IMAPT is not on it - it's actually on the manifold itself.
  • You have the MAF and is on the snorkel where the air filter is at. Just remove it and look it over closely.

Or you may have the IMAPT sensor - located on the MANIFOLD itself between Cylinder 2 and 3.


Pay particular attention to the sensor tip...
​

• The tip is two pieces - one is a THERMISTOR the other is a port over a pressure transducer
  • The Thermistor is a bulbous tip - that senses air and the temperature of it - compared to a known reference of a wire of known resistance at a specific temperature when subjected to a current applied thru it - when you place this in moving air, that tip cools off at a given rate - so that changes the current flowing thru that tip - that signal is amplified and sent to the ECM as a means to tell the system "How much" air is moving thru the system.
  • The pressure transducer looks at the pressure - it's vacuum, or less than sea level - like towards the upper atmosphere region - air is thinner (less pressure not as much air per volume the manifold is) so it does not need as much fuel to burn.
  • So it looks at the changes in the air flow - the greater the change, means the throttle should be opening up - so it looks at the Throttle position and your Accelerator Pedal Position sensor between the two it tries to figure out load on the engine using the MAF as part of the "Triad" to tell the system to inject more or less fuel into the cylinders.
  • You can look more at this here in this thread It's the second half of this TRIAD of sensors used to make the charge so the cylinder can fire. Your Foot, the Air Velocity going in and the Volume of air as a given pressure.

​

So if you can get under the hood, see what those plugs look like to help us help you figure out what to do.

 

[Yowakawaka]

Today borrowed my neighbors code reader, cleared the codes, and took it to my friends smog shop. He scanned it and told me it had a permanent p0420 code so it won’t pass. To get rid of it I need to drive it so the computer deletes it. I’ve put about 120 miles on the car and it’s still there.
When I got home, my roommates friend from Arizona was in town and he is a mechanic. I told him about the problems I’m having with the car and he hooked up his scanner. It was one of those fancy ones with the hand held screen. 1st, he tried to turn in my fan and it wouldn’t work. We could hear the relay click when he tried to activate the fan but it didn’t turn in. 2nd, he pulled the codes and found p0054. The description was HO2S Heater Resistance. I think this is because of the spark plug non fouler but I’m not sure. It wasn’t there before. 3rd, regarding the “misfire” and shutting off. I couldn’t make it repeat what it was doing and he said he didn’t know why
said it’s probably a good idea to replace the timing belt if it’s never been replaced. I reached out to the old owner of the car to find out. I also pulled the cover the best I could to see the belt and it looked fine.





I took some time to look at the water pump. I didn’t see or feel any wet or what looked to be wet spots. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it.

I also looked at fan. What I found was it didn’t spin freely. It was jammed with something. It kinda felt like a pine needle or something was stuck in there. It took a little force and it broke free. I kept spinning it both ways until it was free. I let the car run for a bit but it didn’t come on. Not sure it it just wasn’t hot enough or what. Now that I think about it, I should have used the live data on the scanner my neighbor let me use.

That was pretty much the whole day. Car life happened.

I’m gonna take some time to pull the plugs and do a compression test next. I don’t have a leak down tester but do have a compression tester. Should say a lot.

@SyntheticAtmosphere @Handy Andy I’m going to check the MAF or IMAPT sensor as well.

 

[SyntheticAtmosphere]

Did you have any other codes besides the P0420 (and now the P0054)? You might have an issue with the downstream O2 sensor...

• DTC P0054 stands for “HO2S Heater Resistance (Bank 1, Sensor 2)”
• This is set when the PCM detects a potential issue with the heater circuit of the downstream (post-catalytic) oxygen (O2) sensor in the engine bank 1.
• Code P0054 is commonly set because of damaged wiring and connectors, a faulty oxygen sensor, or blown fuses.
• Symptoms of P0054 include a lit check engine light, reduced fuel economy, and the appearance of other related DTCs.

The oxygen sensor must be hot (about 600 degrees or higher) before it will start to generate a voltage signal, so many oxygen sensors have a small heating element inside to help them reach operating temperature more quickly. If this circuit has failed, this will generate a "not ready status". You replaced an O2 sensor already, but now I am wondering why you wanted to install a fouler instead of looking deeper into why the sensor wasnt working. At this point I would suggest visually verifying the wiring is not damaged and connectors are in good condition. Next would be to diagnose the electrical circuit(s) which is very involved.

Your fan not working would give you the overheating issues you are experiencing. If the relay is clicking, the next step is to see if you have voltage and a good ground at the fan when it is commanded to turn on. If yes, you need a new fan. If no, you have a wiring issue to diagnose between the relay and the fan. This would be a relatively easy electrical venture compared to the O2 sensor above. One cheap trick is to turn on you A/C (if equipped and operational), the cooling fan should either turn on or start cycling which would verify the fan has power, ground and is being commanded by the PCM. However cars today have multi-speed fans and might still have an issue within the system causing it to not operate properly. Disconnect the cooling fan and put a headlight bulb across the cooling fan harness pins. With the cooling fan commanded on, the light should light up bright. If the bulb lights up, the cooling fan is faulty. If the bulb lights up dim or not at all, load test the power and ground to the cooling fan. Repair the wire that fails the load test.

As more information comes to light the issues become more apparent.

 

[Handy Andy]

Just so you know...your mentioning the fan acting like it was stuck on a pine needle - might mean the motor is shot in it, as in it took out the bearings - so it's fried. The motor may be seized, so you're only able to roll the fan because it's no longer able to stay "stuck" to the shaft - it just freewheels.

Try to find a new shroud, most of the junkyards may have several - and might work - but only for a day or two then they are shot. Lots of the older shroud and motors in them - are brittle plastic and high mileage fan motors - not worth it unless you need to swap parts to check for a fix.

 

[Yowakawaka]

Hey @SyntheticAtmosphere @Handy Andy

I’m gonna do the compression test and check the MAF sensor. Should I clean it with the spray after I take a photo? I’ll send you photos of the plugs too. Should be by late tonight.

Also, I got confirmation that the timing belt has never been replaced so I want to change it with the water pump. I’m looking into a cat as well. I’m getting together a parts cart and will let you know when it’s done.

Regarding the codes, I think the new code may have piped up because the spark plug fouler I put in. It definitely wasn’t there before.

I’ll let you know how everything goes later!

 

[Yowakawaka]

Results are in. Check out the spark plugs. Note, I post 2 pictures of each spark plug so there’s a better view of each one

Cylinder 1





Cylinder 2




Cylinder 3




Cylinder 4




They all look pretty much the same. I believe the white strap is high heat. The black soot around the circle part wasn’t thick by any means. What do you guys think?

Making another post for the compression test and MAF so I can fit all the photos.